[Monster] Aroike [Founder Review]

by **Gossamer** on June 13th, 2010, 6:21 pm

The only issue I have with this writeup is two-fold. First you state in your description that they are wiry then say they are powerfully built. In nature, you cannot have both. Animals are either or but not both. Heavy frames that are considered 'powerful' are not allowed to glide. Light frames that are wiry would work. Sure this is a Valterrian created creature, but truthfully you cannot have both. I can see a powerful modified flap creature but one that just uses its flaps to dive, rather than actually glide. The image created for this monster is amazing, but it doesn't scream glider to me at all. It's too unruly for such things.

Now...

My other issue is this.

Diet: These creatures enjoy the taste of meat and marrow to supplement their feeding, but they require large amounts of blood to sustain themselves. It is blood that they hunt for, and blood that they crave. This biological need more than anything dictates the small size of their social groups. Though their slow metabolism gives them the ability to go for a week or sometimes two without feeding, they must still eat regularly. Even the endless expanse of the wildlands would be unable to supply enough blood for these creatures to congregate in large numbers.

When feeding the Aroike typically puncture an artery and drink whatever blood they can suck from the victim. Once no more blood is available they tear free fat, muscle, and bone to chew. Upon draining the remaining scraps of their fluid they crack the bones, eat the marrow, and leave the remains on the ground for scavengers.

This is a big creature. Just looking at it tells me blood won't do the trick. It seems cliche and too 'its a mutated bat monkey thing!' for my tastes. Can we ditch the blood thing and actually have it eat a wide variety of foods - human meat perfectly acceptable and a large chunk of their diet included? Really... if you're light as a feather and have incredibly thin bones and weigh almost nothing like a bat does, then blood makes sense. Even high protein makes sense. But this fellow is gonna need some fruits and veggies too.

by **Sturlin** on June 14th, 2010, 12:11 am

I disagree on the wiry versus powerful statement. Power is not based solely in size, as evidenced by the reference in the writeup to chimpanzees. I meant only that they are built for power, and are wiry in appearance. If you think the wording is misleading i'll edit it appropriately

Several aspects of this creature were based off of the African lion, and the concept (on my original drawing board before things were fleshed out entirely) was an intelligent carnivore, not an intelligent omnivore. I've examined lions extensively (meaning I could still be wrong) but i've not seen any reference to them consuming any fruit or vegetable matter as part of their diet.

(What I mean to say is, African lions are rather large as well, and it follows that something the size of the Aroike would capable of sustaining themselves in a similar manner)

I understand not wanting blood to be their main diet, i've edited the entry to reflect that they enjoy drinking blood but that their main diet is meat.

Posting edits below, so you don't have to hunt for them:

"Wings": Fearsome indeed is the silent predator which can dive from above. The length of an Aroike's arms and legs are connected on each side by a wide flap of tough, furred skin. When leaping from treetop to treetop they can be seen spreading both arms and legs wide to drift upon the air. This is in truth little more than a leaping gait through the treetops rather than a glide, though the flaps do assist in precision and distance of the leap. The smaller the Aroike, the further it can dive without risking injury to itself. All Arioke, regardless of size, are able to achieve a controlled dive from the limbs of a tree.

Diet: These creatures require large amounts of meat to sustain themselves, but blood is their favorite food. It is meat that they hunt for, and blood that they crave. This biological need more than anything dictates the small size of their social groups. Their slow metabolism gives them the ability to go for a week or sometimes two without feeding. In spite of this, the large amount of meat required for a single feeding, coupled with the number of Aroike in each pack, helps to keep the population down. Even the endless expanse of the Wildlands would be unable to supply enough meat for these creatures to congregate in large numbers.

When feeding the Aroike typically puncture an artery and drink whatever blood they can suck from the victim. Once no more blood is available they tear free fat, muscle, and bone to devour. Upon consuming all of the edible meat they crack the bones, eat the marrow, and leave the remains on the ground for scavengers. At times of celebration the blood will be collected in simple flasks and gourds to be devoured communally, as a delicacy.

by **Gossamer** on June 14th, 2010, 12:33 am

You are perhaps thinking of the cute little baby chimps they show on TV ala Cheeta etc. Adult chimps are huge, powerful, and incredibly dangerous... even though they weigh less than humans overall. They have denser muscles and bones and a skeleton that's incredibly tough. I think they range right around 100-130 lbs as adults, females being a bit smaller... but undoubtably no one in primate biology would consider them wiry. Spider monkeys? Sure... but not chimps. They are little powerhouse chunks.

Felines have incredibly short GI tracks that are unable to process sugars and cellulose found in plants like fruits and veggies. I didn't even remotely get a 'cat' feel from this writeup though, since the head of the thing looks like a bat and the body looks humanoid. Humans and baths both have incredibly long complex GI tracks that demand complex sugars and carbs in their diets, not just animal protiens which are super simple to digest.

That's where my thinking came from. I can only go by your description and the image to go by what should be what. Blood consumption is cliche, and all sorts of creatures have a wider variety of diets.

by **Sturlin** on June 14th, 2010, 1:15 am

Thinking more of the adult chimps which I see twice weekly as I visit the zoo for exercise. To me, when you compare the size of them to the size of a human along with the amount of strength they possess, they look wiry. Denser muscles and bones are exactly what I was going for. Perhaps it is the definition of the word wiry and the phrase powerfully built that we just are not seeing eye to eye on. I will edit the entry to avoid further confusion by eliminating the word wiry entirely.

My point is, if felines have the ability to survive solely on meat, if any creature has the ability to survive solely on meat, then another creature could conceivable function the same way. Especially a mutated Valterric monster in a fantasy setting.

Blood consumption as a staple of the diet may be cliche (I honestly don't see it, because the only thing that really comes to mind is a vampire and this doesn't resemble a vampire), but certain human cultures have enjoyed the taste of blood, and anyone who loves the taste of liver or heart could understand the love of the taste as well. I did adjust the entry to reflect that they do not survive off blood, they just love it. I don't think that item alone makes the creature cliche given its diverse nature.

The enjoyment of the fluid could harken back to their history as a different creature, or as a mashup of multiple types of animal since one happens to be a bat. Bat-monkey things shouldn't be too strange, since our own lore reflects that some aberrations have occurred which mashup different species. Hopefully the name and creature are both memorable enough that it will simply be known as an Aroike, rather than the sum of its parts. (Which also, incidentally, include marsupials from which I received inspiration for the retractable climbing claws and the overlarge tail. No pouch though. Not a fan of pouches.)

I would prefer to keep them carnivorous. I think there are any number of creatures in Mizahar that would not hold up under the weight of intense scientific scrutiny by the biologists. Hopefully this one's not too big of a deal.

by **Gossamer** on June 14th, 2010, 3:46 am

Well, this converstation is pretty well a moot point now - regardless of what you consider wiry and what myself (and quite a few others) think.

In the D&D Monster Manual version II, page 62 is the Desmodus. This is an ape like intelligent creature (very violent that runs in packs) with a bat-like head, and a membrane that runs beneath their arms. Credit goes to Gillar for pointing this out to me casually and then downloading the MM to make sure he wasn't wrong.

We cannot approve this article with this creature being almost straight out of D&D. I'm sure this wasn't intentional, but in the Creative Manifesto, we specifically outline this fact. So, without significant physical characteristic and social changes, it simply won't work.

Strive for originality

When you are an indie in your field, it is your duty to be innovative. Use familiar archetypes, but implement them in original ways. We sure have lots of undead, but if you are looking for emo vampires, you have come to the wrong place. Do not rip off other fantasy worlds, but imagine how a certain idea could exist in the world of Mizahar.

by **Harlequill** on June 14th, 2010, 4:25 am

Really? I mean. Really? If you compare the two pictures: They look nothing alike. If you compare the origins: nothing alike. If you compare the abilities: nothing alike. If you compare the societal situations of each: nothing alike.

The only way that they are similar is in the over simplified way that you have mentioned.

by **Harlequill** on June 14th, 2010, 4:27 am

Shall I look up giant eagles in the monster manual? You told me to remind you when you were being unreasonable. Ding.

by **Dusk** on June 14th, 2010, 4:36 am

As an attempt at finding a middle ground, what would it take to "use familiar archetypes, but implement them in original ways"? Like, how is this not a new twist on something that is, admittedly, really obscure and I've never heard of despite having played D&D for years and years?

by **Gossamer** on June 14th, 2010, 4:38 am

Dire animals are historically part of our world - since the time of Pangea. There is no plagiarization involved. The fact that another Founder can look at an image, read the description, and say "Oh, that's a Desmodus from MMI"I means that it is too alike to be approved.

There have been numerous original monsters written up without any of these problems. There's nothing to say this one can't be made original too, getting away from the appearance of a well known D&D monster. We came from a game where the lore was populated by D&D creatures - basically cut and pasted. We promised ourselves when we created Mizahar, this would not happen here. The physical description is spot on... and unique enough that it is identifiable.

by **Dusk** on June 14th, 2010, 4:48 am

Actually... this is what they have for Desmodus:

Which, while having a bat face and a humanoid body, doesn't really seem to be the same thing. They also, according to the write-up, live underground. Which means to me that they'd have an entirely different structure than the Arioke write-up. And I suspect there's not the in-depth descriptions of biology, etc.

Could Gillar draw a connection to a D&D monster? Yes, but you could do that with almost everything, because D&D's basically cornered the market on monsters. So again, I'd say this at worst it should be considered a unique twist on an archetype (which most of our players wouldn't even recognize and wasn't done intentionally, as it seems some of the things on your previous website were), and should still be considered on its own merits since that doesn't break the rules.