Agriculture/Society. [Pre-pre-approval discussion thread]

[Basiliscos V Argomedo]

I read the other day about a lack of farms and farmers in Mizahar. I also noticed a unique type of rice in Mura. I think other unique foodstuffs could be a way to make Mizahar more interesting and flesh out it's societies and economies.

This leads me to how to go about making a fantasy crop. I think one of the more important questions when developing a new crop for a civilization or race is:

What is the ratio between how labor intensive a crop's growth is, and how much food is produced? :

To give some real world examples of the way staple crops and other foods affected societies:

Wheat in the middle ages required both plenty of land to farm efficiently (Two to three fields, one of which had to be worked even when fallow), and each stalk only produced a few grains (Unlike the plentiful stalks of today). This meant that a large amount of people had to employed in what was a poor endeavor, which favored a system where people where tied to the land they farmed.

Rice is also interesting, which was farmed much like wheat, until the innovation of the rice paddy. This produced much more caloric yield, but was much more labor intensive, skilled labor, in fact. Expansion wasn't as necessary as plenty of water replaced the need for large tracts of land. Due to the small amount of meat in diets, meant little land was needed to maintain large populations. So, instead of going out and conquering as a way of spreading civilization, as in Europe and the Middle East, mountainous and less fertile areas in China were assimilated generally more slowly but smoothly.

And one last example is Maize. As far as staple grains went, it was certainly the most efficient. It didn't produce as much caloric yield as rice, but more than wheat. It practically grew itself after planting, requiring only 1 out of 8 days of work. This meant large populations could be sustained, and pursue other activities, such as war or star-gazing. I think staple foods like these are rather well suited to fantasy environments, for this reason.

Maize is also interesting in that it took longer to spread to different areas, as it was eventually incapable of reproducing naturally, and therefore had difficulty adapting.

Land in general wouldn't be much of a problem in most of Mizahar, I assume, as people have plenty of areas to expand to. Assuming they aren't being held back by bandits/monsters/environment.

Some possible unique foodstuff examples and/or their attributes:

Eypharians have a small amount of fertile land to grow crops (Well, according to the most of the lore, a great river is mentioned somewhere, but I assume that idea was scrapped as I couldn't find it elsewhere). They also don't seem to be the kinds to take to farming much. I imagine they would be good at something like planting rice paddies, however. A high yield foodstuff might be appropriate for them, and due to their use of slave labor, it could be labor intensive. Not too labor intensive though, as they outnumber other races in their city. Something that perhaps takes well to extreme climates.

Maybe foodstuffs that produce allergies in all but one or two races. Or ones ones that are very picky about where, when or the way they are grown. Perhaps some that require more Djed absorption than others. Or ones that were specifically altered or created by the Valterrian.

Some other possible types of domesticated plants might be narcotic tubers, or other types of drugs. The effects of different addictive plants could be fun to explore. Drugs being outlawed could also produce interesting situations. They would have to be synthesized like poisons, though, if merely for balance issues.

Perhaps a crop that is unique to Sylira in some way, helping the city dominate or control the food market in their region, as they seem to.

I need some clarification on the way food works before truly diving into this, though. I read in the lore for Djed that it is replenished by food, does it take the place of energy in this setting? Are all the real world essential nutrients required for humans?

Any ideas, criticisms, insults and questions would be greatly appreciated.

[Jilitse]

I am from a semi-agricultural semi-capitalist country known as the Philippines, and I have worked closely with farmers so I am quite knowledgeable in the subject. Not to say that I would like to raise a banner on being an authority on the subject, but instead, I think, that you should put into consideration the fantasy theme of Mizahar first before reality.

The first thing to think about is: How would people roleplay it in-game? I can assure you, rice, wheat crops are truly, truly labor intensive, and I cannot imagine myself typing that I opened up the irrigation and spread the fertilizer (probably cow dung) every other few days. Oh, and just think about planting with Mizahar's level of technology. The life of a farmer is very repetitive, so with a detailed wiki close to real life, I believe it will actually boring to write.

The Eypharians and Ahnatep were made by Colombina, so if you have any questions regarding how farming is conducted, I believe it is better to ask her first than make assumptions. To which I'd also like to ask you if you've come across the Houses of the Four Winds? You should know that the House of West Winds are farmers, and although not detailed enough, the kind of crops listed there will give you an idea how flourishing the farming lands are. They even produce Mirage, which is like the equivalent of Opium around here, I think. From my knowledge, water is provided by the Pressorah, hence this great river you talk about, but in rations wherein you cannot take more than what is given, or else death, or something like it. Colombina is still in her honeymoon, so let's wait a few more weeks to get her ideas in. Or maybe you can also send her a PM?

Syliras has a great big farming community outside the Fortress, and I assume that with a population of 15,000, it would not be only rice crops, but would also include vegetables and fruit-bearing trees. I assume they are in no means, a dominant food producer, but are in fact, the food producer in the region. Zeltiva has its fishers, fishing being part of agriculture, too. The Domain Storyteller is Dusk, who is also quite busy at the moment, but I'm sure Selena will be coming back soon.

I shall diligently follow this discussion, and if it yields something valuable, I would like to write about a great animal help known to our farmers, so dibs on the Carabao.

[Basiliscos V Argomedo]

Ah, I suppose I should of clarified a few things, very characteristic of me to leave a few important points out. This is more an idea to develop articles. RPing being a farmer would be up to individual people, but it seems possible now, without any unique crops. Unique crops would also mean a more fleshed out type of trade between cities, which making a merchant character I am a bit more interested in RPing, very selfish of me, I apologize.

As to contacting Colombina, the example was just that, a possible example as to how a fantasy crop might work. I'm mostly trying to gauge to see if people are interested in something like this, actually developing crops and talking to DSes would be the step after this.

And I had skimmed over that article, in my rush to read more. It seems the great river was destroyed after the Valterrian, which would explain the discrepancies I was seeing between springs and a large river feeding Ahantep. Except the small river/spring, which I admit I hadn't considered.

Can we give the Carabao a scorpion tail? I kid. Thank you for all your feedback and interest and stuff.