On Falyndar

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On Falyndar

Postby Gossamer on January 27th, 2013, 4:10 am

Best thing that's been said in this thread so far:

It's about THEM and as soon as you make it obviously about them, then they will come a'runnin'. - Phoenix
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On Falyndar

Postby Schism on January 27th, 2013, 4:20 am

Well it's a good thing I'm just putting out what I remember from discussion with Cayenne and not stating it as canon, but this isn't the first time you've put words in my mouth. This thread wasn't about getting two cents and ignoring everything that came before, but whatever, if you don't want to focus on the thread topic, that's your prerogative. In the meantime, it's a bit of a disruption to what the thread's for. What I listed in response was an understanding, a perspective, of something I took from Cayenne and our chats, and all those little logs are here if someone wants to see.

The box code is pretty, and I've been in reach with the PCs in the region. I know it's tough and magic things won't happen over night, and this is one of those in your face things asking about the region, and I'm interested in hearing thought on Zinrah in particular.

Now, if this thread could actually stop bringing up this whole status thing - nothing of which prior holds precedence to me claiming any right or authority to the region as a whole - and actually return to thoughts on Falyndar's lore and set up, that would be really cool. Every question tot he players doesn't need to be stirred up into some question of authority when I'm actually going to players in an open DISCUSSION forum to talk about these things. So, the same question is standing for whoever comes upon the discussion regarding what kinds of locations, threads, etc., would 'you' like to see in Zinrah? in Falyndar if other STs draw anything from this discussion, as per the thread title?

I'm totally down for people trying to settle in Falyndar and if there is anything int he Jungle Wilds to do about it that's fine. What I'm asking is is that a thread people would like to go for, and if they are post here and shoot some ideas because no one here can read minds. If it is, sure, we can do that, and we in Falyndar can be coordinating for summer to see that to fruition.
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On Falyndar

Postby Gossamer on January 27th, 2013, 4:24 am

Schism wrote:
You opened this topic up for discussion. You asked some pretty hard questions. You're getting some pretty thoughtful heartfelt responses. Let me remind you:

Schism wrote:Disclaimer: I'm only AS of Zinrah and – by Cayenne's allowance – can oversee the Jungle Wilds. Being an AS in the region though, I needed to be fairly knowledgeable about the other domains. There are forces interacting and all that jazz, you know? But let me just say I can only speak of Zinrah's canon with certainty because well…that's my crib. I can discuss other things in speculation, but it's still open for me too. :P

Anyway, back on topic here. Falyndar, that vast dangerous jungle in the west, would like love too. But, as it's plain to see on any of the region's forums, it's been kind of ignored or has gone unnoticed. Even if I focus on Zinrah, I need to scratch my head and ask, "Why is Zinrah not as valid a location for plots? What are players looking for in a region/domain like this?" I ask this even more so for constrictor Dhani who might otherwise call Zinrah their home! Snakes that will eat you? Sure, but that's not always true; there are exceptions. Myrians are definitely terrifying in masses, but they need to catch you first. So what do you think, believe, and know about Falyndar exactly? Please drop by, whether you're thoroughly familiar with the zone or just gave the region a few read-throughs. One thing that can get you as a ST is being so familiar with your domain you forget what it was like looking from the PC perspective, hehe… A few staff members are looking over the region to help with others being busy, so share ideas, we're all eyes. Hopefully we can make something happen to open the zone up a bit more without losing its integrity: that notorious reputation for being the bastion of wild danger, Caiyha's own playground.
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On Falyndar

Postby Elysium on January 27th, 2013, 5:10 am

Hi Schism. Since this is an open forum for dicussion, I thought I'd put my opinion out there.

You said something in particular I found alarming upon reading the thread:
This thread wasn't about getting two cents and ignoring everything that came before, but whatever, if you don't want to focus on the thread topic, that's your prerogative.


I think all discussion up until this point has adhered to the thread topic. As those before have so artfully pointed out, this thread is about getting everyone's two cents. You asked how to improve active plots in the region. No one has claimed you said anything you previously have not. That being established, from what I gleaned, all responses thus far merely made suggestion (adminstrative or otherwise) to simply improve and expand on what is already there. Not throw it all away. You can take or leave those suggestions, but I disagree with that particular reply. Remember that you opened yourself and the moderation in general up for constructive criticism.

As a brand new AS, I think I can speak from experience in saying we have boundaries. Assistant storytellers can make certain judgement calls, but any and all assertions on the culture not directly regurgitated from the lore should be left to DS or higher. We as AS have no rights to any of the established gods or races. Everything you stated beyond direct quotation is merely conjecture and will only serve to promote confusion and misinformation. I understand under-staffing, but there are other Founders to take cues from. This is not intended as a jab.

Now, if this thread could actually stop bringing up this whole status thing - nothing of which prior holds precedence to me claiming any right or authority to the region as a whole - and actually return to thoughts on Falyndar's lore and set up, that would be really cool.


This isn't an issue of authority. It's one of organization and continuity. You made assertions about Siku, Caiyah and Myri that you can't because you did not write them. No one is putting anyone down about staff rank. :) Being a staffer at all is a point of pride for all of us. It's just structured in this way for a reason.

I agree whole-heartedly with what Phoenix said. All of it. I don't see how engaging players are growing a player base don't equate to that same thing in your eyes. You said:
It's not "how do I get more players here?" It's, "How do I enhance this region for those who want the rawness of the world before them"


You are enhancing the world for the players, and you need them in order to do so. It's a mutually beneficial relationship between PC and ST. Therefore there's no real distinction. You do want to draw people in and that's not a bad thing! Without our players and their initiatives, being a storyteller is moot. :)

This is a discussion, not an argument and these are simply my views. Thank you for reading.
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On Falyndar

Postby Cascade on January 27th, 2013, 6:52 am

Imass wrote:I just want to make a quick comment on the human settlement thing... Just because it is near impossible doesn't mean it shouldn't be done. Like Goss said things need to played out IC. Just let the humans come, let them try, and let them fail all IC. I can see it being a very awesome story arc for a couples seasons in the jungle.

Imass


I think this is one of the best ideas I've seen mentioned here. :)

The other day in chat, I think Anchor was brainstorming on an idea about a Falyndar outpost that basically connects the sea with Falyndar's cities. I wasn't paying much attention cos I was multitasking and then I had to go, but I think he got some feedback such as 'no, that's going against the lore'. Lol I don't even know what was against the lore because there were a lot of things being said and I just couldn't stare at the screen long enough. Again, I reaally have to read up on Falyndar (all I'm up to speed with at the moment is Black Rock), so I've no idea idea what's okay and what's not. But if it's against the lore to have something like that established, you can at least make a quest out of it -- aka people trying to get in, attempting to establish routes and outposts, and failing (or succeeding, yay).

For the most part, I think the best way to get a more active player base are quests, being visible, and paying attention to what players need. I know it's been mentioned but it's important enough to reiterate. Btw I know this isn't answering your original question but you'll see that it leads to the same thing.

Good luck, Schism. :)
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On Falyndar

Postby Paragon on January 27th, 2013, 10:48 pm

Pardon me, but I'm going to be frank, and perhaps a little big headed to boot.

Sure, you have boundaries as an AS. Oh well. Just communicate then. Use the Help Desk. Chat to the Founders. Get them on AIM and brainstorm. Use your coord. I had much of Zeltiva developed as an AS. Yes, as an AS. By liaising with Colombina, Gossamer, and (at the time) Tabarnac I fleshed everything out so the city was user friendly. No one brought up an argument of authority or whatever you said. You stir these things up all on your own.

Why the hell do you think Zeltiva is bustling? Zeltiva was nigh on dead before I took it over, with only the key locations that Liminal had lovingly created. I have constant storylines and plots going on (IN THREADS, IN INTERACTIVE FASHION). I have living NPCs with personal lives and their own evolving storylines. I have guides, tons of locations to cover player needs and bolster the city's flavour, I have news bulletins, unique systems to my city that reward players, and the list could go on.

The things Phoenix said are absolutely spot on. Announce additions to your city. ALWAYS keep a line of communication with players. If you don't, your domain is dead. Simple as that. Dead. I welcome new players. I PM them lots of the time, Echelon and I keep really keen eyes on all our new arrivals, ask them if they need employment, want moderation, point them to the guide, even consider how different players could fit into events and quests e.t.c

And the approachable bit. Everything I've seen from you in the Staff Lounge in the past has been either super controversial, unnecessary, or passive aggressive. When people get passionate, you twist it into an attack against you as if you want some sort of blow up. It's disconcerting to say the least.

Now... tangible things going forward.

Keep your players up to date in OOCs, welcome new players and ask them if they need help with things. Keep up with frequent news bulletins and announcements, make sure everyone knows whats going on. Start fleshing out locations - and ask the players if there are things they'd particularly want to see in the domains. Get a calendar up with events, and pick a few of those to make open threads about. Create a living plot line. You have had SO much time to make locations, and yet you've barely done anything in the last few months and then come here asking how you can make your domain buzz more. The answer is absolutely staring at you. Making a few token locations in your first month as ST and then simply leaving the domain is totally ineffective. It's an ongoing, organic process.

I also love the idea of a human outpost. I think that's a definite win, and accessible entry point into Falyndar. Once I had a character that I travelled to Falyndar with, and just to enter Taloba I had to go through some thread which threatened my character's life and he was then given severe restrictions within the domain. How the heck did the Falyndar STs hope to ever attract players with something like that? The human outpost means people can freely get a foothold into the region, and eventually they'll fan out and explore the other domains.

Good fortune!
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On Falyndar

Postby Verilian on January 28th, 2013, 4:30 pm

Okay, so I'll probably repeat myself a bit here, but since you feel that a lot of us didn't answer your question, I'll try again.

Why is Zinrah not as valid a location for plots?
I don't understand what you are talking about. Just make some plots. How about running a quest where the Dhani try to break the blockade? Or better yet, why haven't the dhani just tunneled under it? Run a quest, doesn't matter if they succeed or not, but run a quest where the dhani try to spread out. That sounds like an excellent plot to me.


What are players looking for in a region/domain like this?
Quests. Seriously.. for me, that's what brought life to Ravok. I mean.. you can make plenty of cool locations, but honestly, people don't use location threads very often. Not from what I've seen in Wind Reach and Ravok, anyway, the two cities I'm most familiar with. Locations are great as a reference, but they aren't what attracts players. Plots are. Plots in which they can affect the story of the city/domain. My first quest in Ravok introduced a rebellion. I have kept that plot alive for.. however long I've been an ST now. I started a war with Sylira. In the region as a whole, we came up with the regional quest involving the fragment. In Zeltiva, they've got that crazy labyrinth thing now. Echelon and I have been discussing quest ideas to bring Nyka to life. Devlopment is great, but players want stories most of all. You can have the prettiest city of all, filled with amazing locations and a rich lore, but without quests for the players to do that actually have real impact on the world, they won't come to the city.


I ask this even more for constrictor Dhani who might otherwise call Zinrah their home!
I put my dhani on hold because I didn't see enough storyteller activity. Pretty much all there is to that.


So what do you think, believe, and know about Falyndar exactly?
I think Falyndar is a really cool place. I wanted to play a dhani, who was a phylonurist, and do phylonuristy type stuff. Why? Because the lore said jungle phylonurists have the hardest job of all of them, and I wanted that job. I know that Falyndar is extremely dangerous, so I wanted to start off in Zinrah, so I could build up my skills before striking out into the wilderness to care for it. I know that if you aren't Myrian, you're extremely limited to where and what you can do. But I didn't want to play a Myrian. I think that Falyndar is a really cool reason, but it needs a lot of work. Even for the players there, unless you are Myrian, there isn't much you can do. You asked why Zinrah isn't a valid plot location? Well.. it's a hole in the ground with only 200 citizens. That's fine, but what plots really can you do? Other than to try to expand.. I mean, there shouldn't be a lot of conflict inside Zinrah simply out of necessity. It doesn't make sense to have cool quests in the city, because quests usually involve conflict of some sort, and if the dhani want to survive, really they should avoid all conflict with each other. They should all be working to find a way out of Zinrah, a way past the myrians.


Please drop by, whether you're thoroughly familiar with the zone or just gave the region a few read-throughs.
I am not thoroughly familiar with the zone, but these are my opinions.


Hopefully we can make something happen to open the zone up a bit more without losing its integrity: that notorious reputation for being the bastion of wild danger, Caiyha's own playground.
I think most of the stuff mentioned in this thread should help to do that, if you would consider it all. But what I think the players want, what I as a player want, is stories. Lots of awesome stories that I can be involved with. I personally don't care about locations. They are a tool, an accessory that I use to enhance my stories when I need them. But what I, talking as a player rather than a storyteller, want is cool quests to get involved with. Or if not that, like Jen stated, stuff that I can do on my own. In Ravok, I have the "Rumors of the Ravosalamen." Most of these rumors are just thread ideas which generally do not require moderation, but often are somehow linked to the overall story of Ravok. I'll be making revealing a more advanced version of that soon. But again, it gives players stories they can get involved with other than their own plots (because the stuff we make up, we always have to get storyteller approval of anyway if we want them to affect more than just ourselves) but still don't require me to mod. And of course, I am always running more modded threads than I can handle, but that's just my style.


Anyway, these are my answers to your questions. This is what I would want as a player, and things I think other players might also want. If I repeated myself.. well, good. So.. bye bye for now. Happy threading!

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